(;FF[4]
GM[1]
DT[2018-03-27]
PC[OGS: http://online-go.com/game/12224931]
PB[bugcat]
PW[jthat]
BR[7k]
WR[7k]
TM[3600]OT[5x60 byo-yomi]
CP[online-go.com]
RE[B+R]
SZ[19]
KM[6.5]
RU[japanese]
C[bugcat: Hey.
jthat: hello have fun :)
bugcat: Let's have a good game.
]
;B[pe]
;W[po]
;B[do]
;W[ee]
;B[cd]
;W[dc]
;B[cc]
;W[db]
;B[df]
;W[jd]
C[tsmcdona: What an interesting beginning!
]
;B[pc]
;W[ch]
C[Fuurya: Indeed tsmc, commentator Fuurya speaking here
Fuurya: Yes, it seems that both players rely on an experimental fuseki
Fuurya: The fate of the game might be decided at the very end of the fuseki if one of the players achieves their plan
tsmcdona: Feels like bugcat needs to come out after C12 so he doesn't get surrounded
climu: I think E14 fix the cut isn't it?
]
;B[cg]
;W[dq]
C[tsmcdona: Wow, wasn't expecting a tenuki
]
;B[fp]
C[climu: I would have D12 as black I think
tsmcdona: These players are playing at a level far above human understanding
climu: ^^
]
;W[co]
;B[dp]
;W[cp]
;B[cq]
C[tsmcdona: White still owes a move at the top right?
climu: top right?
]
;W[bq]
;B[cr]
C[tsmcdona: left sorry
]
;W[br]
C[tsmcdona: I meant right as in correct
climu: oh :)
climu: yea 
tsmcdona: I bet the bottom will be a fight for sente then
]
;B[eq]
;W[dr]
;B[cn]
;W[ck]
C[tsmcdona: Commentator Fuurya, what are your thoughts on these recent developments?
Fuurya: I think Black has a good sente move at B6 followed by b D12 that could really hurt white
Fuurya: The crowd is going wild as we speak
]
;B[ek]
;W[jp]
C[Fuurya: But black decides to cap right away. Is he prepared enough for this fight? Only time will tell
]
;B[pq]
C[Fuurya: But oh! White decides to tenuki and take the extension on the bottom side effectively reducing black's potential there
]
;W[np]
;B[qo]
;W[pp]
;B[qp]
;W[oq]
;B[qm]
C[Fuurya: This looks like the avalanche joseki but with an extra white stone at O4, not a good situation for black
]
;W[qq]
;B[rq]
;W[qr]
;B[rr]
;W[pr]
;B[fg]
C[Fuurya: Maybe blacks aim for a greater scale attack than what would be available with D12
]
;W[gd]
;B[lc]
;W[kc]
;B[ld]
C[tsmcdona: I think white needs to help out his two stones on the left asap
]
;W[qd]
C[tsmcdona: Lol white is tenuki crazy this game :D
]
;B[qe]
;W[qk]
;B[qi]
;W[pm]
;B[ql]
;W[pl]
;B[rk]
;W[pk]
;B[ic]
;W[jc]
;B[oi]
;W[mg]
;B[pd]
;W[og]
;B[pg]
;W[ne]
;B[of]
;W[nf]
;B[nc]
;W[le]
;B[bo]
;W[bp]
;B[er]
;W[cs]
;B[dm]
;W[bm]
;B[bn]
;W[bh]
;B[cj]
;W[bj]
;B[ci]
;W[bi]
;B[bl]
;W[ei]
;B[dj]
;W[dh]
;B[gh]
;W[bf]
;B[cf]
;W[bg]
;B[be]
;W[bk]
C[Fuurya: There's the E13 cut that's pretty dangerous as well
]
;B[cl]
;W[fj]
;B[ej]
;W[fi]
;B[hj]
;W[ef]
;B[eg]
;W[dg]
;B[dd]
C[Fuurya: It's a bit too late to cut now that black has J10
Fuurya: *H10
]
;W[ed]
;B[de]
;W[gk]
C[Fuurya: Maybe w E8 if w gets F8
Fuurya: *H8
]
;B[hk]
C[Fuurya: *G8 ugh
Fuurya: \[object Object\]
]
;W[hi]
;B[gi]
;W[gj]
;B[ih]
;W[ii]
;B[ji]
;W[hl]
;B[ij]
;W[el]
;B[dl]
;W[fk]
;B[fl]
;W[gl]
;B[fm]
;W[jk]
;B[ke]
;W[nj]
;B[mh]
;W[kg]
;B[lh]
;W[kh]
;B[ki]
;W[je]
;B[lk]
;W[lm]
;B[iq]
;W[ip]
;B[jq]
;W[kq]
;B[kr]
;W[lq]
;B[hp]
;W[hq]
;B[hr]
;W[ho]
;B[gp]
;W[kf]
;B[kl]
;W[jm]
;B[jl]
;W[km]
;B[mk]
;W[nl]
;B[il]
;W[im]
;B[cb]
;W[ea]
C[bugcat: oh no
bugcat: byo-yomi
bugcat: the main time was so short
bugcat: ;)
jthat: ^^
bugcat: jk jk
]
;B[lr]
;W[mr]
;B[ml]
;W[mm]
;B[kb]
;W[jb]
;B[lb]
;W[rj]
;B[rl]
;W[qj]
;B[ri]
;W[si]
;B[sh]
;W[sj]
;B[rh]
;W[ls]
;B[hf]
;W[jr]
;B[ir]
;W[ks]
;B[hd]
;W[he]
;B[ge]
;W[ie]
;B[fd]
;W[gc]
;B[fc]
;W[fe]
;B[gf]
;W[fb]
;B[ff]
;W[ec]
;B[nk]
;W[oj]
;B[oh]
;W[ng]
;B[gn]
;W[hn]
;B[gm]
;W[hm]
;B[me]
;W[lf]
;B[nd]
;W[oe]
;B[pf]
;W[go]
;B[fo]
;W[dk]
;B[em]
;W[di]
;B[el]
;W[qn]
;B[rn]
;W[pn]
;B[ca]
;W[sk]
;B[ro]
;W[sm]
;B[rm]
;W[sl]
;B[sp]
;W[mj]
;B[es]
;W[li]
;B[lj]
;W[mi]
;B[nh]
;W[sn]
;B[so]
;W[rs]
;B[sr]
;W[al]
C[bugcat: I've made an utter hash of this endgame
]
;B[ol]
;W[nm]
;B[ok]
;W[od]
;B[pi]
;W[pj]
;B[om]
;W[on]
;B[oc]
;W[ll]
;B[kk]
;W[jj]
;B[hh]
;W[kd]
;B[is]
;W[ae]
;B[ad]
;W[af]
;B[js]
;W[kr]
;B[if]
;W[mf]
;B[md]
;W[am]
;B[ja]
;W[ia]
;B[ka]
;W[cm]
;B[an]
;W[ak]
;B[ap]
;W[aq]
;B[dn]
;W[jh]
;B[ig]
;W[da]
;B[ao]
;W[ac]
;B[bd]
C[bugcat: no way this works
]
;W[bb]
C[bugcat: hang on, I'm not sure you can claim a seki if you can't fill
bugcat: I reckon they count as dead
]
;B[ba]
C[bugcat: after I play this
bugcat: because it's a ko forever, right?
bugcat: you can never win and fill the ko
bugcat: after A19
]
;W[aa]
C[bugcat: I refuse to capture
bugcat: I maintain that the stones are dead
jthat: ?
bugcat: I think the A19, A17, and B18 stones are dead
bugcat: I wanted to pause until we've resolved it
jthat: then kill them :)
bugcat: I don't believe I have to play that ko
bugcat: since you can never win it
bugcat: theoretically I htink they count as dead
bugcat: I'd like if we could get a dan player's opinion
jthat: well if they are dead then kill them right? :)
bugcat: no, I thikn they are dead already
bugcat: they are just dead stones in my territory
jthat: ok then dont kill them lol
bugcat: no, we'll be fair, I'll call Dave in Discord
jthat: wut... lol
bugcat: I don't think I'm obliged to paly the ko that's all
bugcat: I lose a point if I capture
bugcat: I think the rules say those three stones are just dead
bugcat: not trying to be rude or anything but I thikn that's the correct ruling
jthat: ok
bugcat: I called a couple of teahers
bugcat: I jsut want to sort it out properly
jthat: ok
bugcat: Right, I got BoneSaw to rule it for us
bugcat: Thanks
jthat: gg well played
bugcat: You too
bugcat: Oh, BoneSaw said the stones are just dead
bugcat: but anyway, thanks for the game
bugcat: hey
bugcat: Well that's what I said, White can never fill to make the seki proper
bugcat: he can never "win" the ko
bugcat: yeah, I agree
bugcat: Right, time for me to have dinner before it gets cold. Thanks to tthe four people who were always watching the game
bugcat: no idea who they were
bugcat: yeah, indeed
bugcat: see you all later
sethwildebuggy: hi!
BoneSaw: In order for black to win the ko, white must have kill/seki potential
BoneSaw: Let me rephrase
og1L: top left? white is dead. there is no way for white to win anything.
BoneSaw: As long as white can do nothing even by winning the ko, there's no reason for black to do fight it
BoneSaw: If there was an eventual kill/seki potential then the ko would need to be played out
BoneSaw: See you and congrats on the win, bugcat
]
)